Peter, I'm with you here, but let's get the right spin on the ball. Tia admires her teacher, that's as it should be, but, as you say, beside the point. It's not a matter for the listminister since i imagine Tia's has gotten the point by now. Lee criticized the quality of the argument not of the person. wayne --- Peter Bi <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Dear Tia Ballantine Berger: > > This mailing list is for Discussion on Ezra Pound, > NOT for discussion on Lee > Lady or Jonathan Morse. > > If you find any personal attack, you'd better to > talk to the administrator of > this mailing list. > > Thanks. > > Peter Bi > http://www.card4you.com > > Tia Ballantine Berger wrote: > > > Hello Lee lady, and all: > > > > As a student in Professor Morse's graduate > seminar, I am profoundly grateful > > for the lively and well-informed atmosphere of all > of our sessions. > > Professor Morse has a wealth of information (about > Pound, Whitman, and many, > > many other poets as well) that he freely shares > with a great deal of wit and > > with careful attention to detail. His explications > of the Cantos are > > thorough and thrilling. During this seminar, Morse > has provided us with a > > rich contextual and multi-dimensional background > that includes biographical, > > historical, political, and philosophical > information that allows us, as > > students, access to a greater and certainly to a > deeper understanding of the > > poetry. This seminar has been a marvelous > experience, and I am not saying > > this to enhance my grade. I am not worried about > grades--I concern myself > > with knowledge. > > > > I consider Lee Lady's personal attack on Professor > Morse, aired on a public > > list, to be in poor taste and rather studiously > childish. > > > > Tia Ballantine > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Everett Lee Lady <[log in to unmask]> > > To: <[log in to unmask]> > > Sent: Sunday, December 05, 1999 1:19 PM > > Subject: Re: Getting things dead wrong > > > > > >Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 02:16:13 -1000 > > > >From: Wayne Pounds <[log in to unmask]> > > > >Subject: Re: Getting things dead wrong > > > > > > > >From: Jonathan Morse <[log in to unmask]> > > > > >Subject: Re: Getting things all mixed up > > > > >SNIP< > > > >No > > > > >economist of any standing has ever paid the > > > > slightest attention to Pound's > > > > >ideas about money, for instance, > > > > > > > >Dead wrong. Read Giano Accame, _Ezra Pound > > > >Economista_, 1995. Massimo Bacigalupo reviewed > it for > > > >Pai. (Accame a journalist whose field is > economics and > > > >cites reputable sources.) The review inspited > y.t. to > > > >read this book --hasn't anybody else read it? > > > > > > Since it's in Italian, it's probably not widely > available > > > in the United States. Any sort of summary you > could post > > > here would be welcome. > > > > > > Even if it were in English, however, and more > readily > > > available in university libraries in the United > States, > > > most academics specializing in Pound would > probably not > > > bother to read it, because as we see by their > comments > > > in this list, they simply can't be bothered to > learn > > > the territory. > > > > > > I don't have a problem with people who claim > that the > > > only interesting thing about Pound is his poetry > and > > > literary criticism and that his life and > non-literary > > > interests can be ignored. I do have a problem > with people > > > like Morse, who was actually teaching a graduate > seminar > > > in biography this semester focussing on Pound > (as well > > > as Walt Whitman), and who can't be bothered to > learn the > > > background that would enable them to understand > Pound > > > in context. > > > > > > I have a problem with people who look at the > Agresti > > > letters and only see the 5% which deals with > Jews > > > since that's the only part they can make any > sense of > > > because they simply don't know anything about > any of the > > > books and other things Pound really cared about. > > > > > > To even talk about "Pound's ideas about money" > is to > > > show that one has completely missed the point of > who > > > Pound was. Pound was not a thinker, he was an > enthusiast. > > > He had some very acute perceptions, about > literature at > > > least, and he liked to look at old and obscure > books > > > and discover things which had been long > forgotten, and > > > he had a keen intuition (although not always a > reliable > > > one) in seeing connections that most people had > not seen > > > before. > > > > > > But you cannot discuss his works in the way one > generally > > > discusses the works of thinkers, in terms of the > reasoning > > > and evidence cited, because Pound does not > provide a > > > systematic intellectual exposition. This was > not the > > > level Pound's mind worked on, and it's one > reason so > > > many of the ideas he championed (which were not > "Pound's > > > ideas" but the ideas of others) in the realm of > government > > > and economics turned out to be so foolish. > (They were > > > not so obviously foolish, though, in the context > of the > > > era in which Pound first learned of them.) > > > > > > So instead of a reasoned discussion of Pound's > ideas in > > > the fashion of in which one discusses the ideas > of thinkers, > > > we see here absolutely childish criticism, such > as > > > "The fact that Confucianism is worthless is > proved by the > > > way the Chinese have treated women." > > > > > > ----- > > > It is a question not of being happy or > fulfilled, but of being on fire. > > > --- Anais Nin > > > > > > Lee Lady > <Http://www2.Hawaii.Edu/~lady> > ===== Via Betti, 289E/2 16035 Rapallo (GE) Italy pho: 0185-234-140 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com