In a message dated 06/22/2000 12:33:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [log in to unmask] writes: << I would like to add that the Church dogma dictates the doctrine of transubstantiation or in layman's terms, the bread and wine ARE actually the body and blood of Christ in "real presence" in this Blessed Sacrament, these Communion elements esp. the consecrated Host. >> in addition to which, if one arrives at mass after the consecration of the host, one is deemed to have missed the mass. the principal raison d'être for the mass is said consecration, so to attempt to meaningfully distinguish between the two is, well, ignorant. I am, of course, referring to the mass as it existed in Pound's day. joe...