Fascism has as one of its guiding tenets the exclusion of certain groups of
people...
who do not belong within the identifiable boundaries (guiding mythologies)
of the
group in power (the group which sets the agenda for what is right, valuable
and
worthy of perpetration).... it makes victims of those who are not identified
with the
fatherland... indeed, with Fascism, the myth of of national identity demands
an
exclusionary clause... an us and them mentality is central to this... i.e.:
the
farthest point one can go from a Confucian ethic which upholds the ideal of
jen
(human-heartedness) in all human intercourse. Ironically, to the extent that
Pound list members exclude some of their fellows on the basis of academic vs
non-academic, published vs non-published.... and to the degree that they use
this perception in order to promote their own identity, etc... to this
degree they
are fascist.
Stoneking
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Kibler <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Friday, August 27, 1999 8:15 AM
Subject: Re: EP and academics
> No, I certainly would not, and in fact, for years, just the opposite was
true. I judged the magnicifent ideality of the Soviet Constitution--or the
communist experiment--by the actuality of Soviet communism. Having lived in
China, and having travelled extensively in the Societ Union, I have seen
first hand the oppression an ideal social program can bring to actual social
situations. So when in graduate school, where many students and faculty
remain fashionably Marxist, I took the position that we should not be
irresponsibly wielding political ideologies as a literary tool, when they
have caused so much damage to human beings on the planet. Lit crit should
not exist or operate in a complete vacuum. Lit crit should not separate
ideological cause from real time effect.
> But you know, I am not as sure now that any social ideology causes the
damage--whether it is democratic, national socialist, monarchist, fascist,
roman catholic, protestant--what have you. All they do is prove--their
presence proves--that people want to bond together for protection against
enemies real and imagined. They want to believe in something, be productive,
triumphant, and in the right. And they want the rewards that should come
from right action. But the ideologies themselves simply become a vehicle
for those who would drive them. And those who do drive them--they are nearly
always the problem. They can take any ideology where they want it to go.
> Fascism is no better nor worse than any of the other isms out there.
And it has a beauty--a good intention, in ways--and in ways, it even
resulted in some positive social effects. What did Pound say--he wished that
his work would be examined in its parts, and not taken and judged at once,
as a whole. The Fascist doctrinal texts deserve a read--as does the
communist manifesto, and the historical records of the See of Peter. And in
like manner, we should learn to separate out what is positive from what is
negative, even from that which seems to have an overwhelming amount of the
negative to it. My response that fascism gets a rap is directed against
wholesale judgements. It is so easy to say 'and yes, fascism,' then roll our
eyes and bond in agreement that it was a horrible, despicable nightmare for
the world and for people. It may have been that too. But I would suggest
that we not consider THAT the whole story, that we instead look at the story
in its parts.
> As society, like academia, moves further and further away from
condoning or promoting anything like independent thought, the accepted use
of history is as a series of summary, wholistic soundbites. They are, after
all, a lot easier to acquire than is a diverse judgement of parts. And such
wholistic judgements are becoming the ever more requisite shibboleths to
social acceptance.
> Call it a quirk, but of this I am wary.
> >>> Daniel Pearlman <[log in to unmask]> 08/26 9:16 PM >>>
> I'm sure you would not judge the actuality of Soviet communism
> by the magnificent ideality of the Soviet Constitution.
>
> ==Dan
>
> At 05:49 PM 8/26/99 -0500, you wrote:
> >As a utopian vision, Fascism has some merit. Mussollini's manifesto, for
> example, promotes some of the same kind of ideas as does Confucius--a need
> for order, but within order, flexibility. The need to subordinate the
> individual to the whole. Some may argue against the merit of this--and I
am
> not sure that I like it myself--but it is the same impulse that built us
> great cathedrals in the middle ages, for example. Like fashion, certain
> terms, like certain writers, become throw aways--especially in the
academy.
> That is, for years, it was fashionable to condemn Nietzsche, because of
> the alleged connection between his philosophy and the Nazis. It in fact
was
> so easy to condemn him that no one had to read him. Yet there is no Nazi
in
> Nietzsche. If anything, he is sort of Buddhist. For years (even now) it
has
> been easy to throw away Pound, rather than to read him. How many of you
> have encountered resistance somewhere along the line when you suggested
> that you liked Pound? How many people have had difficulty getting
> professors to teach him? What is his place in the Modernist anthologies?
> Likewise, there are some darn compelling essays on fascism as a social
> program.
> > And they finally got those swamps drained in Italy, right?
> >
> >>>> Joe Brennan <[log in to unmask]> 08/26 5:26 PM >>>
> >since I'm obviously (I thought) punning, it has several meanings --
assent,
> >of course, and also a comment on pound's "political leanings."
> >
> >jb....
> >
> >In a message dated 8/26/99 3:41:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> [log in to unmask]
> >writes:
> >
> ><<
> > i trust this acknowledges your assent, and not a
> > declaration of political leanings...
> >
> > Stoneking
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Joe Brennan <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Sent: Thursday, August 26, 1999 3:05 PM
> > Subject: Re: EP and academics
> >
> >
> > > or even right on....
> > >
> > > In a message dated 8/26/99 2:53:48 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > > [log in to unmask] writes:
> > >
> > > << right.
> > > >>
> >
> HOME:
> Dan Pearlman
> 102 Blackstone Blvd. #5
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>
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