Tim, when you speak of archetypes, forget culture altogether; forget
geometry, too. In archtypes, it's the individual Patterns, and not the One,
entire construction, that we must dissect. The construction is already
dissected, thanks to all the jungs and the freuds.

In regrd to what you wrote before [With his discovery of the archetypal
nature of the Self]: What Pound discovered was not just the fact that
patterns direct us, but that there's something that fuels the patterns.
Call it "the green world" if you like.

And he rejoiced.

-Ahsan

At 06:31 AM 9/11/00 -0400, you wrote:
>Bob,
>
>When I mention The Archetypal (as I have done in several contexts over the
>past few months) you think in terms of socio-cultural paradigms. This is not
>what I mean by the term. Also, an "assumed persona" --where ego scriptor
>writes "in the voice" of some legendary person--  is not what I mean by the
>archetypal, though it is possible that the person whose voice and role are
>assumed represents an archetype.  What I have in mind when using the term is
>the immutable cross-cultural erotic geometry that brings Persephone to
>Hades, Narcissus to Echo, foam-born Venus up from the sea into which the
>blood of her father's castrated genitals had fallen, et cetera. I'm talking
>about the soul's double-helix, if you will.  It means we belong to the green
>world. The green world does not belong to us.
>Tim Romano
>
>
>
>
>> tim,
>>     i can see the various personnae ep assumed qua
>> ego scriptor; but, can't see anything archetypal
>> ...as for example whitman's american adam,
>> or emerson's jeremiah.
>> how do you mean ep's "archetypal self"?
>> another american adam?
>>
>> bob
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Tim Romano <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 7:39 AM
>> Subject: No place of grace
>>
>>
>> > Bob,
>> > With his discovery of the archetypal nature of the Self
>> > Pound progressed from Solipsism into Nature and Creation
>> > to rediscover 'the green world' thereby completing the circle.
>> > This universal place of grace he saw threatened
>> >    by the relentless mechanization of human labor
>> >    by the rapacious exploitation of natural resource
>> >    by the endless barrage of soul-less advertisements
>> >           and other projections whose goal was destruction
>> >             of the inner-sanctum
>> >              that we may become insatiable hedonistic consumers
>> >                  who show up for work on time
>> >                  and pay every tax
>> >                  and cheerfully submit our selves to the machine.
>> >
>> > Fascism was salvific for Pound for the paradoxical reasons you imply.
>The
>> > directed will seemed indeed a manful remedy for the smothering machine.
>> > Fascism projected an image of the nobility of the artisan versus the
>> > dehumanized slave-labor-units of soviet socialism.  It seemed to hold
>the
>> > promise of no more red-tape ... a government that would govern least,
>> > organized around the collective will of the skilled trades. Imagine how
>> > powerful its attraction for a liberty-techne'  freak like Pound.
>> >
>> > Tim Romano
>>
>>
>