Lose face? Who ever had 'face'? "In a regime of grand larceny, petty
larceny ranks as conformity."
I wish it were mere "bungling." Following the Kivunim plan the
'bungling' is just a smokesceen for the successful fragmentation of
Iraq--- a situation that is now pretty much a done deal. But the
Kivunim plan is a security plan. The PNAC plan for example is a strategic plan in the classic capitalist sense despite its Were-Wolfowitzian regional democratization horseshit---oil, natural gas and water easily accesible to western markets through a puppet state. Its a "comprehensive" version of the old CIA 'strongman' approach e.g. the U.S.'s early support for the Baathists and by extension Saddam---an oil grab disquised as a theoretical method for creating a more durable and oppressive security situation and one that requires less direct monitoring and funding. Aspects of the American neo-con plan are diametrically opposed to Israeli 'machinations' for example a Shi'ite majority in the South absorbed by religious and cultural affiliation into Iran and hostile to the U.S. and an independent Kurdestan that threatens eastern Turkey. However, having said that, the carpet bombing of western Iraq along the Syrian border is being done not to root out Iraqi nationalists and insurgents, but to secure pipeline routes along the Syrian border that originate in the newly minted de facto Kurdestan, through Jordan into Israel. So one could say that elements of the Kivunim plan have been adapted to current circumstances. It certainly was discussed among the principles.
But back to Pound. Sorry. Ez sez hasn't been much on my mind lately. CP
Charles Moyer wrote:
>Carlo,
> Yes, it ain't hard these days to loose face with the guvment esp. if you
>happen to notice its "bungling" in Iraq is resulting in exactly what was
>machinated in the 1982 Kivunim plan.
> That said I'll raise my libertarian glass to Vermont's secession.
>
>Charlie
>
>"The state is a clever institution for protecting individuals from one
>another; if one goes too far in ennobling it, the individual is ultimately
>weakened by it, even dissolved - and thus the original purpose of the state
>is most thoroughly thwarted." -NIETZCHE
>
>
>
>>From: Alphaville <[log in to unmask]>
>>Reply-To: - Ezra Pound discussion list of the University of Maine
>><[log in to unmask]>
>>Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2006 10:31:56 -0500
>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>Subject: Re: FW: ALA panels, etc.
>>
>>Charlie,
>>
>>I was chatting with a couple of wonks from Langley over lattes at
>>Pentagon City other day and one made mention that a Navy Gulf Stream V
>>used for "renditions" would be available the week of the ALA conference.
>>Maybe I could put in a word for you, your Leer jet being grounded and
>>all. Of course, they can't guarantee destination or hotel accomodations.
>>Apparently, more often than not what you find on your pillow rather than
>>a mint are pieces of your own face. CP
>>P.S. Thanks for the enlightening entries.
>>
>>Charles Moyer wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>----------
>>>From: Charles Moyer <[log in to unmask]>
>>>Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2006 06:59:34 -0500
>>>To: - Ezra Pound discussion list of the University of Maine
>>><[log in to unmask]>
>>>Subject: ALA panels, etc.
>>>
>>>Bob and potential panelers,
>>>I appreciate the invitation to present a paper in SF, but unfortunately
>>>May will be the month that my Leer jet will be in for repairs. So I will
>>>have to offer the following by way of this poor list in hopes that it may
>>>brighten the affair in some remote way.
>>>
>>>In further consideration of the Pound and Islam discussion-
>>>"Let us search for Mr. Upward's dangerous and heretical doctrines." -Pound
>>>and
>>>"Every high creator in Western history has in reality aimed, from first to
>>>last, at something which only the few could comprehend." -Spengler
>>>
>>>In his Table I. "Contemporary Spiritual Epochs" Spengler puts Avicenna
>>>in the period of "Autumn", particularly among "the Great Conclusive
>>>systems". To be more specific this autumn represents the "intelligence of
>>>the City. Zenith of strict intellectual creativeness." What follows is
>>>"Winter (Dawn of Megalopolitan Civilization. Extinction of spiritual
>>>creative force. Life itself becomes problematical. Ethical practical
>>>tendencies of an irreligious and unmetaphysical cosmopolitanism) In terms of
>>>Islam = practical fatalism after 1000" AD - and what comes out of it
>>>nowadays?
>>>Pound is a Spengler Faustian. He displays the "symbolic infinity"
>>>expressed by the Faustian world-feeling, "the mechanical and extensional
>>>re-ideation of the idea of immortality and world-soul" - Pound's "conspiracy
>>>of intelligence outlasts the hash of the political map" and, one may add,
>>>the ravages of the ages. Kung and Athena can and do enter this stage set by
>>>the Cantos one now then another among many to visit the shadow-boxing sage
>>>in his Pisan cage. In the parlance of Spengler the "Olympian college is
>>>historyless, it knows no becoming, no epochal moments, no aim. But the
>>>passionate thrust into distance is Faustian."
>>>And Pound is such a Faustian heretic. But then all Fausts are heretics.
>>>However, all heretics are not Fausts. Is the question's stakes now raised
>>>from Islam and salvation promising religion to one of immortality of another
>>>brand? Or was the question always not about Islam and Pound but Aristotle
>>>and his followers and Pound's perception of them?
>>>
>>>Charlie
>>>
>>>"'Tis the white stag, Fame, we're a-hunting,
>>>Bid the world's hounds come to horn!"
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>From: Robert Kibler <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>Reply-To: - Ezra Pound discussion list of the University of Maine
>>>><[log in to unmask]>
>>>>Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2006 13:10:05 -0600
>>>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>>>Subject: Re: Pound panel(s) at the ALA?
>>>>
>>>>I think you do go straight to the heart of the matter with this question,
>>>>and
>>>>I do think Pound reconciles his pragmatism with his 'goddess' tendency in
>>>>identifiable if changing ways in the cantos, on his way to paradise. I guess
>>>>I
>>>>am looking at those points or modes of reconciliation.
>>>>And of the two then, Avicenna is more a Dante type, while Averroes,
>>>>condemned
>>>>somewhere along the line by everyone, seems more in line with a Pound, as
>>>>before him, a Cavalcanti.
>>>>
>>>>I swear, there are enough people talking about Pound and Islam here that we
>>>>should be able to put together a panel session offering three worthy
>>>>perspectives. If so, can some shoot me or Burt Hatlen or Alec Marsh a title
>>>>and an abstract for ALA, so that we can make a case for this general topic?
>>>>We
>>>>need titles, leastways, by 20 January, as I understand it. Thanks in
>>>>general,
>>>>Charles, and thanks in particular for offering a clarifying question about
>>>>Pound. .
>>>>As for dualism, dualist religions, philosophies, life approaches, et
>>>>cetera--aven't these often worked their separate ways--such as the
>>>>Eleusianian
>>>>Mysteries--understood one way by the true believers, and another by the
>>>>politicians and group leaders who saw something operating behind the
>>>>spectacle
>>>>rather than simply in it? Averroes has a great quote regarding the multiple
>>>>layers of reality or perception/understanding of reality operating among
>>>>people, but as it is, I have to install a light fixture and get to the gym
>>>>before the Washington Redskins take the field.
>>>>So please, all of you out there in cyberspace, consider offering a paper on
>>>>Pound and Islam at ALA. I can do something. Are there two others out there
>>>>willing to do so? Robert K
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>The person of excellence understands what is moral.
>>>>The petty person understands what is profitable.
>>>>"Analects" IV.16, Confucius
>>>>
>>>>Robert E. Kibler, Ph.D.
>>>>English and Humanities
>>>>Director, Northern Plains Writing Project
>>>>229 Hartnett Hall West
>>>>Minot State University
>>>>500 University Avenue West
>>>>Minot, North Dakota 58701
>>>>telephone: 701 858 3876
>>>>e-mail: [log in to unmask]
>>>>fax: 701 858 3894
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
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